worst decisions made in Winnipeg history

[vid]

Originally Posted by Smron

I was actually referring to the trees on the streets. However, I don't think the actual forests would need controlled burns to remain healthy. It would probably benefit them, but it's not like the forest is going to die otherwise.

It won't die, but it won't be as healthy. It will also post a greater fire risk as time goes on.

[Spocket]

If we've had one single biggest mistake as far as downtown goes it has to be that we allowed it to be depopulated. I could be wrong about that actually but we certainly haven't given the matter much thought until recently.

For the city as a whole, developing a more efficient transportation network seems to have been a boat this city missed. In all fairness though, for city of our size, we really have nothing to complain about when it comes to transportation. I just mean that it could be a lot better (and that doesn't necessarily mean freeways but in some cases it can)

To be truly fair about all of this , these 'mistakes' were products of their times and certainly weren't considered mistakes at the time they were implemented. For example, Portage Place may not be the saviour of downtown that it was intended to be but as Andy pointed out, it's unlikely that things would have been better if it had never been built. In all likelihood, Portage Place has indeed been a positive for the core. Sure, now we look at it and think about what we didn't do but at the time it made sense and we didn't have the benefit of hindsight.

[DAVEinEDMONTON]

Originally Posted by Andy6

I don't see how "the mall downtown" made things any worse than they were. It's actually not a bad building as these things go. It didn't revive downtown, but for all we know it arrested the decline somewhat. I think it has a legitimate part to play in the downtown fabric, providing much-needed indoor shopping space in a city with extremely cold winters. Somewhat unusually for a downtown mall, it was built without any major anchor stores, since it was bracketed at either end by the two huge early 20th century department stores, the Bay and the T. Eaton Co., to which it is (was) connected by skywalks.

I would agree that the mall downtown was not a bad idea. I just think the location may have been wrong. They probably thought by centering close to the two major department stores that they would create a shopping destination. It may have been better to be closer to the majority of office workers on Portage and Main. Seven blocks is a long walk in the middle of winter to do some lunch time or after work shopping. TD Square in Calgary, City Center in Edmonton and Pacific Center in Vancouver are all right in the heart of the business district and the stores feed off the business workers during the day. The other problem is the Portage Avenue street frontage which could be more pedestrian friendly. More security and maybe better lighting would help to make the main entrance to the mall more enticing. The mall owners should consider renovating the portage street side of the building to allow more direct store access.

[Andy6]

Originally Posted by DAVEinEDMONTON

I would agree that the mall downtown was not a bad idea. I just think the location may have been wrong. They probably thought by centering close to the two major department stores that they would create a shopping destination. It may have been better to be closer to the majority of office workers on Portage and Main. Seven blocks is a long walk in the middle of winter to do some lunch time or after work shopping. TD Square in Calgary, City Center in Edmonton and Pacific Center in Vancouver are all right in the heart of the business district and the stores feed off the business workers during the day. The other problem is the Portage Avenue street frontage which could be more pedestrian friendly. More security and maybe better lighting would help to make the main entrance to the mall more enticing. The mall owners should consider renovating the portage street side of the building to allow more direct store access.

Well, the mall was supposed to be the solution to the decline of that particular stretch of Portage. I don't think it occurred to anyone in the 1980s that it wouldn't continue to be normal to drive downtown to the Bay and Eaton's to do your shopping, and this mall was just supposed to make that even more attractive, with Holt's moved indoors and some other stores and the IMAX theatre. It was meant to be a destination mall, like Polo Park, not a place for office workers during the day. But it didn't have enough stores or free parking to draw the ordinary shopper away from Polo Park, which was also being greatly expanded at that time. By blocking off two major north-south streets, it also acted as a barrier between Portage and the area to the north of Portage, making that area more of a creepy backwater than ever before. It also became the indoor location of choice for street people. So the best laid plans of the planners once again went wrong.

[IntotheWest]

^Didn't Portage Place open before the expanded Polo Park? I remember in the 80's going downtown for movies especially - Northstar, Odeon, Met, etc...and when Portage Place opened, IMAX and the new high-end theatres.

Even when I worked downtown in the 90's, I still like Portage Place, mostly because of the Bay and Eatons, and the indoor connections.

Too bad. A lot of great memories downtown.

[dennis]

I think the Polo Park renovation was completed in 1986. Portage Place opened in 1987.

[vid]

Remember when all movie houses were downtown? Now all we have is SilverShitty.

[Andy6]

Originally Posted by dennis

I think the Polo Park renovation was completed in 1986. Portage Place opened in 1987.

Yes, I'm certain Polo Park was completed in 1986 because one of my last errands as a resident of Winnipeg was to buy something or other at the almost-finished mall that summer. Portage Place was underway at that time; my friend's dad was the architect (or Number Ten generally was) and I remember talking about it but it wasn't finished until after I'd become a Torontonian.

[LilZebra]

Originally Posted by IntotheWest

^Didn't Portage Place open before the expanded Polo Park? I remember in the 80's going downtown for movies especially - Northstar, Odeon, Met, etc...and when Portage Place opened, IMAX and the new high-end theatres.

No, the expanded Polo Park opened in mid-August of 1986. Our family was in Vancouver and Edmonton for Expo '86 at the time so we missed the official opening. But I did get a chance to check out the renos. daily in '85 and '86 as I was attending an "Electronic Communications" course at Sturgeon Creek Regional Secondary School.

Portage Place opened the next year, mid -September 1987.

[rrskylar]

I've always thought that Portage Place Mall should be renamed; The William "Bill" Norrie Mall, both are useless appendages!

[vid]

No, name it after Burton Cummings! There aren't enough things named after Burton Cummings!

[IntotheWest]

Okay, so it opened after Polo Park expanded...it was still quite busy when it opened though - especially because of IMAX, the new "high-end" movie theatres, and being connected to the largest Eatons and the Bay. I personally think it was good for the block, despite how it looks now...the apartments/condos behind it (and the offices on the main floor) was a great idea as well.

Vid - yes, I loved the movie theatres downtown...its too bad that no one could figure out what to do with the Met (is it still there?? Haven't really noticed last time I was in the Peg), the Garrick, old Odeon (Burton Cummings/Walker?), etc...I can probably even tell you the last movie I saw in each of them - definitely back when going to a movie seemed more like an "event".

Anyway, what is with the Burton Cummings thing anyway? I don't believe he even lives in the Peg anymore (or hasn't for a long time)!

[Greco Roman]

Originally Posted by IntotheWest

Anyway, what is with the Burton Cummings thing anyway? I don't believe he even lives in the Peg anymore (or hasn't for a long time)!

Oh I don't know. Kind of reminds me of Calgary's claim to fame over Banff. They really have little to do with eachother; one is in the mountains, and one is not. Similar to Winnipeg and Burton, Calgary thinks it "owns" Banff, and that Banff be nothing without Calgary, when we all know that is a crock of shit

[vid]

Fort William's Odeon is now a huge pawn shop. The Capitol (which is part of VicVille) is vacant. Port Arthur's Cineplex is still going they just had a film festival. Their Capitol is a night club, and the Paramount is a kids indoor fun place (like Chuch-E Cheese), but they've preserved the Paramount sign, ticket booth, paintwork, everything. From a distance it looks like its still operating.

The old theatres, however, are either gone or in bad shape. Hard to believe it has barely been 10 years since the death of downtown cinema.

And Burton Cummings is notable. Same reason everything in Thunder Bay is named after Prince Arthur, Duke of Wellington. He's a well known celebrity!

[1ajs]

i have my memories of portage place in the 90's used to go there with my mother and do out shoping hit up eaton place then eatons then pp then the bay and then go home i miss that... i am dieing for a store like CBIT downtown though...........
www.cbit.ca (local store on st james)

[Pootkao]

I would put failing to build rapid transit at the very top of the list.

Followed closely by zoning and planning policy that rewarded suburban development and ignored the inner city. Draw whatever relationship to the formation of Unicity you want. Hell, I'll just agree with Flatlander and say Unicity.

The downtown planning of the 50's -- a demolition and parking lot-paving bonanza that in hindsight the city has never recovered from.

[MooseJets]

Letting the Jets leave in '96. Then building the MTS Centre 1,500 seats too small, 15 years too late and cannot be expanded. Only in Winnipeg would they build an arena that is smaller than the old one.

[IntotheWest]

Originally Posted by Greco Roman

Oh I don't know. Kind of reminds me of Calgary's claim to fame over Banff. They really have little to do with eachother; one is in the mountains, and one is not. Similar to Winnipeg and Burton, Calgary thinks it "owns" Banff, and that Banff be nothing without Calgary, when we all know that is a crock of shit

Huh?

[IntotheWest]

Originally Posted by vid

Fort William's Odeon is now a huge pawn shop. The Capitol (which is part of VicVille) is vacant. Port Arthur's Cineplex is still going they just had a film festival. Their Capitol is a night club, and the Paramount is a kids indoor fun place (like Chuch-E Cheese), but they've preserved the Paramount sign, ticket booth, paintwork, everything. From a distance it looks like its still operating.

The old theatres, however, are either gone or in bad shape. Hard to believe it has barely been 10 years since the death of downtown cinema.

And Burton Cummings is notable. Same reason everything in Thunder Bay is named after Prince Arthur, Duke of Wellington. He's a well known celebrity!

Yes, the removal of movie theatres has hit most every downtown...Winnipeg had some very nice ones.

Re: Burton Cummings, I was kind of kidding...I guess his name has just been more prominent in recent years.

[newflyer]

Originally Posted by IntotheWest

Anyway, what is with the Burton Cummings thing anyway? I don't believe he even lives in the Peg anymore (or hasn't for a long time)!

I am fairly certain Burton Cumming still lives in the Peg, at least part of the year. I have seen him from time to time, when I lived there. I remember a time he was in A&B on Pembina buying a stack of CD's.

He is still an icon in the city. More notorious than many of the other high profile musicians from Winnipeg.