How has the culture of alcohol changed in your city/province since you were young?

[urbandreamer]

Maybe the sale of alcohol will be outlawed within 2 generations when Muslims are the majority in Ontario?

[Architype]

Originally Posted by Acajack

It's not the only main factor but it certainly has a big influence. The 5% Muslims figure is from 2021 and it's the fastest-growing religion in Canada and many newcomers who have arrived in recent years are Muslim. Plus younger generations are more than 5% Muslim as their age pyramid is a lot younger. Montreal and Toronto were already almost 10% Muslim in 2021. Younger generations may now be around 20% Muslim in these cities, and younger people are where a lot of your drinkers are traditionally.

Isn't atheism, or non-religion the fastest growing group? I expect tolerance of alcohol is high within this group.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Architype

Isn't atheism, or non-religion the fastest growing group? I expect tolerance of alcohol is high within this group.

Atheism is no more a religion than not having a favourite hockey team and being indifferent to the sport is taking sides in an NHL rivalry.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by urbandreamer

Maybe the sale of alcohol will be outlawed within 2 generations when Muslims are the majority in Ontario?

Not likely though it could become a lot more frowned-upon, as it is in some areas of British cities already.

[urbandreamer]

No, Sikhism, Islam and fundamental conservative Christianity are the fastest growing religions eg Dutch Reformed, Pentecostal, Community Churches, Chinese Christians, Filipino Catholics.

It's 2050 and neither Lio nor Acajack will be able to buy alcohol under sharia law in their old age.

[YOWetal]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Not likely though it could become a lot more frowned-upon, as it is in some areas of British cities already.

Hard to see this as a negative development in the Britain.

[Architype]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Atheism is no more a religion than not having a favourite hockey team and being indifferent to the sport is taking sides in an NHL rivalry.

I didn't call it a religion, but a group. AFAIK, in North America it is the fastest growing segment of society. Atheists do have diverging views on social issues, but mainly they are liberal.

[WhipperSnapper]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Atheism is no more a religion than not having a favourite hockey team and being indifferent to the sport is taking sides in an NHL rivalry.

Atheists are adamant God doesn't exist. They have taken a side. Agnostics don't have a side. Non religious isn't one group.

[urbandreamer]

I'm quite certain the Old Testament God is a combination of the Sun, weather and war gods of old. I was watching a Christian church service this morning and all they could pray about was "good spring weather for our crops." This church doesn't allow alcohol, and yep, they're Mennonites lol.

I believe in the power of the Sun God; the problem with Christianity is it focuses on events 2000-3000 years ago while ignoring the reality of tribal conflict in the Middle East. Agrarian societies in Northern Europe could relate to the "sheep and shepherd" shtick.

Anyway, most Athiests are white old stock North Americans/Europeans sick of the hypocrisy of RC, Anglican, Lutheran, Presbyterian beliefs. I have yet to meet an Athiest from Trinidad, Nigeria or the Philippines.

[MolsonExport]

Originally Posted by urbandreamer

Maybe the sale of alcohol will be outlawed within 2 generations when Muslims are the majority in Ontario?

come on. This won't happen.

Besides, there are numerous Muslim-majority countries where alcohol is legal.

[casper]

Originally Posted by Marty_Mcfly

I was thinking this too. When I was a university undergrad about 15 years ago, we were all fairly heavy drinkers, and our undergraduate society, along with all others, had a huge focus on mixers, pub crawls, etc. These days those same societies appear to have hard pivoted away from all of that in favour of more family-friendly group events. Very rarely do I see them posting about mixers or pub crawls.

About 15 years ago universities start to do much more structured enterprise risk management. The idea of un-surprised/untrained alcohol service is scary and risk.

A student pub where there are "professionally" trained servers who will cut people off is one thing. A one off party/event is very different.

I think here in BC the big change was restaurants. Pre-covid there were limits on what could be offered as takeout and the restaurants were paying retail and then marking it up. Now they have a lot more flexibility to do off-sales and they get access to product at wholesale discounts.

[giallo]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

come on. This won't happen.

Besides, there are numerous Muslim-majority countries where alcohol is legal.

Yeah, I've partied with many Muslims over the years. They consume alcohol and drugs just as we do, just less so (or not at all) in their home countries. They'd go all out in China and Canada though.

I was in Jakarta, Indonesia (the world's largest Muslim country), and had a fantastic time with the locals. I'd say half drank, and half didn't. Zero judgment to one another.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

come on. This won't happen.

Besides, there are numerous Muslim-majority countries where alcohol is legal.

I believe alcohol is legal in a pretty large majority of what we would call Muslim countries. Though there are restrictions in most. But of course Canada is not without its own restrictions on alcohol, which are often byzantine

That doesn't mean you won't get the side-eye (or in some cases a lot worse) for drinking alcohol in a lot of these countries.

[kool maudit]

Besides, these sorts of "Muslim majority by year X" claims are pretty shoddy. Longtime forumers will recall similar projections about when Calgary will surpass Paris or whatever.

The dramatic upswing in immigration from the Muslim world is based on a lot of delicate supports that will likely prove unique to this era. Beyond that, Ontario is hardly France. Its pool of new immigrants is much more varied (to the point that Toronto would probably see a replay of the Gujarat riots before the fall of Constantinople).

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by WhipperSnapper

Atheists are adamant God doesn't exist. They have taken a side. Agnostics don't have a side. Non religious isn't one group.

People always want to pigeonhole atheists into a higher belief system, insinuating that atheism is in itself a new religion of sorts. Personally I think there is a hidden agenda in that, rooted in the desire to not have society become fully secular.

Atheists just think that the world and universe exist as a kind of biological happenstance, all of which is the most scientifically logical explanation we have for everything.

It's not really a belief. It's as close to "fact" as we've got to go on.

[thewave46]

Not going to get too into the weeds, but aren’t most newcomers to Canada from India, anyway?

Not sure Hinduism is particularly anti-alcohol from my brief knowledge of things.

Outside a few fundamentalist states, widescale prohibition of alcohol is a non-starter from a practical or societal viewpoint.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by thewave46

Not going to get too into the weeds, but aren’t most newcomers to Canada from India, anyway?

Not sure Hinduism is particularly anti-alcohol from my brief knowledge of things.

Outside a few fundamentalist states, widescale prohibition of alcohol is a non-starter from a practical or societal viewpoint.

I'd agree and also I've never noticed that Hindus are anti-alcohol. Though officially that religion isn't too keen on it. But that's true of many other religions, including Protestant Christianity of course.

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by Acajack

I'd agree and also I've never noticed that Hindus are anti-alcohol. Though officially that religion isn't too keen on it. But that's true of many other religions, including Protestant Christianity of course.

Some Hindus do not take alcohol - many of them drink Scotch instead ...

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by kool maudit

Besides, these sorts of "Muslim majority by year X" claims are pretty shoddy. Longtime forumers will recall similar projections about when Calgary will surpass Paris or whatever.

The dramatic upswing in immigration from the Muslim world is based on a lot of delicate supports that will likely prove unique to this era. Beyond that, Ontario is hardly France. Its pool of new immigrants is much more varied (to the point that Toronto would probably see a replay of the Gujarat riots before the fall of Constantinople).

All true. I do think that if you look at demographic trends, there is a good chance that the Canada of the next decades will be a bit more morally conservative than today's Canada. Not just because of Muslims of course. And obviously alcohol may not be the biggest moral lightning rod, either.

[wg_flamip]

Originally Posted by thewave46

Not sure Hinduism is particularly anti-alcohol from my brief knowledge of things.

Alcohol is kind of like meat in Hinduism in that attitudes toward it vary greatly depending on region, sect, caste and political stance, among other concerns. There are many Hindus who abstain completely, and a handful of Hindu-majority states in India are completely dry (e.g., Gujarat).