Downtown Winnipeg Bay store what to do with it? - Page 5

buzzg · #81 Posted **Dec 27, 2019, 5:13 PM**

The word urban is just there to make all the Mennonite suburban housewives think they're cultured.

CoryB · #82 Posted **Jan 6, 2020, 4:42 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by buzzg

Lol exactly what I was thinking. I'm more curious how many people will make the trip out there to see the same vendors that are at T+B and all the other markets every season.

I do know for the first time they're opening vendor applications up to people from outside Manitoba, so there's a mix of wanting to expand while also trying to refresh selection.

Keep in mind Third + Bird has expanded their market to other cities. It is possible part of the reason for the move is to accommodate additional vendors such as those at their markets in other cities.

Also if you want to insult the Red River Ex facility call in a characterless hockey arena missing the ice rink, it looks nothing like a horse barn.

cllew · #83 Posted **Jan 7, 2020, 2:38 AM**

I had a day off and heard the two owners of T&B on one of the radio talk shows a week or so ago, and one of the problems they had with the Bay location was their vendors could not reliably use their wireless credit card apps (Square etc.) to process sales.

They said they did not think that they would have a problem with signal strength at Red River Ex location.

CoryB · #84 Posted **Jan 7, 2020, 3:24 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by cllew

I had a day off and heard the two owners of T&B on one of the radio talk shows a week or so ago, and one of the problems they had with the Bay location was their vendors could not reliably use their wireless credit card apps (Square etc.) to process sales.

They said they did not think that they would have a problem with signal strength at Red River Ex location.

LMAO Good luck with that. There are two spots in the city I have fairly consistently had wireless (mobile) issues. One was Polo Park but that seems to have mostly been addressed. The other is near Red River Ex where I regularly still hit dead spots despite the FOUR wireless service towers in the area. Th9ose dead spots keep happening even when not under peak usage (ie Ex week in the evening). Holding the event under a wireless limiting metal roof should also have no negative impact.

cllew · #85 Posted **Jan 7, 2020, 11:11 PM**

I'm wondering if the EX has installed a robust Wi-Fi network in their building and the promoters expect the vendors to use that?

buzzg · #86 Posted **Jan 8, 2020, 2:47 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by cllew

I'm wondering if the EX has installed a robust Wi-Fi network in their building and the promoters expect the vendors to use that?

Third and Bird hired Bell to install a robust WiFi network in the basement of The Bay, there's routers everywhere. Either they made this up about the issue or they got hoodwinked by Bell.

CoryB · #87 Posted **Jan 8, 2020, 3:43 PM**

I seriously hope the reason Third + Bird is moving to the Ex is not for better mobile coverage. Seriously, that is about the worst spot in terms of a black hold in the Winnipeg area and that includes the well known black hole in River Heights. It is almost as bad as the many network dead zones in rural areas. The worst part is it is with two towers on site an another not that far away (Roblin and the Perimeter).

cllew · #88 Posted **Jan 9, 2020, 12:52 AM**

Not sure if its THE reason but I do recall one of the owners saying that they noticed the vendors having problems connecting to make sales and the move should fix that.

Also brought up was the parking at The Bay and I think that would be more of a reason to move even though the customers will out in an open lot in the middle of the prairie.

scryer · #89 Posted **Sep 25, 2020, 3:08 PM**

I clearly have no news on this but I just thought that I would copy this over from the Skylines thread in regards to what Victoria did with their Bay department building:

Quote:

Originally Posted by zoomer

source

This last one is from the Hudson District where the old Bay department store was converted to condos, and in exchange for the exterior historical preservation they were allowed to build where the former parkade was Victoria's tallest building in behind, plus the smaller rental you see to the right and under construction now directly behind it (you can probably see the pit) a 23 storey rental. It's a shame in some ways as it'll block off the taller building from some angles and it won't stand out anymore in most skyline shots.

Although I think it is kind of awkward (read: sacrilegious) to construct anything on top of the Bay, I do think that Victoria found a good solution for their city as it still retains retail elements on the ground level. After all they wouldn't do anything with the building if the department store was successfully functioning.

What do you guys think?

esquire · #90 Posted **Sep 25, 2020, 3:13 PM**

^ That caught my eye too.

In some respects the ideal would be some type of mixed use project... The Bay on floors 1 & 2, some type of office and institutional use above that on 3-6, and then replace the mess of a parkade with some form of residential, perhaps two mid-height towers in the 15-25 storey range with a podium that includes parking and some kind of useable space at grade, ideally offices of some type at what is a somewhat prestigious location.

It does not seem that far fetched, it isn't relying on some massive white knight to save the place by filling the entire building (could be a bunch of smaller office/institutional users like Gov't of Manitoba/crown corps on 3-4, some company on 5, U of W on 6) but here we are in 2020 and the entire block is still just kind of drifting...

drew · #91 Posted **Sep 25, 2020, 3:24 PM**

This is almost exactly what many of us on here have said the future holds for our Bay downtown.

The centre of the building needs to be opened up similar the Victoria building and the most of the floors converted into Residential.

It's really the only option at this point.

WildCake · #92 Posted **Sep 25, 2020, 3:29 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by drew

This is almost exactly what many of us on here have said the future holds for our Bay downtown.

The centre of the building needs to be opened up similar the Victoria building and the most of the floors converted into Residential.

It's really the only option at this point.

I agree. I think the future is residential or bust.

Regarding conversion to office/commercial, I don't think there are many businesses that value this type of historical look (read: small hip/new company) that couldn't make due with a smaller space somewhere in the exchange. Skip was rumoured at one point but I'm guessing they need more modern office infrastructure (wiring, HVAC etc...) that would be prohibitively expensive to set up at the Bay.

tree · #93 Posted **Sep 25, 2020, 3:45 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by scryer

I clearly have no news on this but I just thought that I would copy this over from the Skylines thread in regards to what Victoria did with their Bay department building:

Although I think it is kind of awkward (read: sacrilegious) to construct anything on top of the Bay, I do think that Victoria found a good solution for their city as it still retains retail elements on the ground level. After all they wouldn't do anything with the building if the department store was successfully functioning.

What do you guys think?

I think that looks incredible. I understand concern for preserving the original profile of our old The Bay building but if the final result was something like that I'd be happy - I also don't think ours would need any extension as its height is already perfectly suited.

I would prefer they keep the color the same though (with restoration of some kind) - not sure if the Victoria one has been changed from the original or not or if its just my bad displays - but the Winnipeg one has more brown-ish tone?

scryer · #94 Posted **Sep 25, 2020, 6:41 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by tree

I think that looks incredible. I understand concern for preserving the original profile of our old The Bay building but if the final result was something like that I'd be happy - I also don't think ours would need any extension as its height is already perfectly suited.

I would prefer they keep the color the same though (with restoration of some kind) - not sure if the Victoria one has been changed from the original or not or if its just my bad displays - but the Winnipeg one has more brown-ish tone?

I would love to keep the original building as it is (but upkept and maybe getting the windows updated?) but I also agree with Drew about maybe opening it up in the centre like they did in Victoria? And I think that a rooftop terrace/garden would be okay as well as long as it would be designed to handle all 4 seasons of Winnipeg (because green washing in the prairies isn't the same as green washing in the west coast...).

Quote:

Originally Posted by esquire

In some respects the ideal would be some type of mixed use project... The Bay on floors 1 & 2, some type of office and institutional use above that on 3-6...

Quote:

Originally Posted by WildCake

Regarding conversion to office/commercial, I don't think there are many businesses that value this type of historical look (read: small hip/new company) that couldn't make due with a smaller space somewhere in the exchange. Skip was rumoured at one point but I'm guessing they need more modern office infrastructure (wiring, HVAC etc...) that would be prohibitively expensive to set up at the Bay.

I'm not that familiar with the office market in Winnipeg but like WildCake said, I think that in order for the Bay building to host offices that it would have to make significant upgrades in order to appeal to those businesses. However in the same breath, with COVID-19, I also have doubts that offices and schools are the way to go because of the move to working/learning on digital platforms. Plus the offices of the Bay building would have to compete with the amenities of modern business parks across the city so, to me, it seems like an uphill battle to secure office space interest from other places.

Regardless the Bay building will need to upgrade and install more elevators if it is converted to residential, so there is the fact that it would remain a big project for any developer to begin with

.

GarryEllice · #95 Posted **Sep 26, 2020, 2:47 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by scryer

Regardless the Bay building will need to upgrade and install more elevators if it is converted to residential, so there is the fact that it would remain a big project for any developer to begin with

.

There are 5 elevators, surely that's more than enough for a 6-floor building?!

scryer · #96 Posted **Sep 26, 2020, 3:54 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by GarryEllice

There are 5 elevators, surely that's more than enough for a 6-floor building?!

Yikes... Did not know that. I stand corrected

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buzzg · #97 Posted **Sep 26, 2020, 5:15 PM**

It's important to note the Victoria store was significantly smaller than the Winnipeg store. As mentioned, residential would require a massive cut-out for a courtyard here.

The Bay here has 4 working elevators (down from original 12, and 6 when escalators were installed). It also has 4 working freight elevators, along with numerous abandoned ones.

If anything is going to happen here, Heritage Winnipeg is going to have to make some successions. There are only 3 things protected in the Winnipeg store:

1) Exterior facade, obviously
2) Curved elevator bank: this is preposterous considering all that's currently left is 2/3 of one of the elevator banks. Also considering its location in the middle of the store, it makes it very difficult for the courtyard idea, and its also inhibiting them from using other floors of the store after-hours as they're in the middle of the main floor.
3) Exterior awning: also ridiculous as it was added in the 60s, so it's not part of the historic facade, and it is hideous. Restoring the original entrances and putting awnings would be way better.

BAKGUY · #98 Posted **Sep 27, 2020, 8:14 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by GarryEllice

There are 5 elevators, surely that's more than enough for a 6-floor building?!

In the many years I worked there I only saw 4 working elevators of which often not all worked when I was there even in the mid 2000's. It was Eatons that had 5 at the front of the store with 2 working sets of escalators in its last decades.
Apparently they had 3 sets at one time and tons f other elevators too..
4 Elevator would not be enough if the building became residential. Also, the escalators are not working and the parts they need are no longer made. carving out some part to build a tower, likely residential above might be the best solution.
With only 2 floors, once HBC divests itself of carrying the 5 empty floors, then they will likely renovate the only 2 existing levels one would hope.
Too bad a supermarket could not be a part of it down in the basement, lower level.