Kapyong Barracks Discussion

[Ando]

Originally Posted by rrskylar

What would you expect? Govt. is always there to mop up business failures for First Nations businesses!~

Yup, you’re not racist.

[davequanbury]

Originally Posted by Ando

Yup, you’re not racist.

Yeah, Im glad he’s out numbered

[rrskylar]

Originally Posted by Ando

Yup, you’re not racist.

Are you even sure you know what racism is? But then again I am for treating all people equally and even that in today's Canada would be considered racist!

[scryer]

... Okay so about my service road question...

[Wpg_Guy]

Originally Posted by scryer

... Okay so about my service road question...

It looks like a service road yes, the city will likely fight them to expropriate that land however for the road widening unless a deal is reached behind closed doors.

[armorand93]

If its like the service roads off Grant, that would definitely be a bonus. Granted it would impact pedestrian culture and the urban feel, but traffic would be alot less of a nightmare with a service road on the side.

[Winnipeg Grump]

Originally Posted by rrskylar

Are you even sure you know what racism is? But then again I am for treating all people equally and even that in today's Canada would be considered racist!

You seem like a dyed in the wool blue Tory, based on your posts, so here's the question - are you not in favour of honouring contracts?

The treaties were legal contracts between the First Nations and the Crown that spelled out, among other things, compensation for European settlers moving onto the land. Those compensations didn't 'fully' take place, so now they have access to land and/or cash in order to do some economic development.

There is no applicability of "I am for treating all people equally" in this context.

On this subject, it always cracks me up that the same people that bitch and moan about the 'burden' that Indigenous people are on white society and who use the tropes that 'we send them so much money, why can't they get on their own two feet like everyone else' will then turn around and complain about the establishment of Indigenous Economic Zones (Urban Reserves).

I mean, pick a lane, buddy.

[bomberjet]

I'm not sure if that's a service road. Or just designating the land for the widened kenaston blvd. It's a pretty basic sketch that leads to interpretation.

IMO it would seem to me there is no service road, and there will be numerous access points to kenaston.

[BlubberMiley]

Originally Posted by Winnipeg Grump

You seem like a dyed in the wool blue Tory, based on your posts, so here's the question - are you not in favour of honouring contracts?

The treaties were legal contracts between the First Nations and the Crown that spelled out, among other things, compensation for European settlers moving onto the land. Those compensations didn't 'fully' take place, so now they have access to land and/or cash in order to do some economic development.

There is no applicability of "I am for treating all people equally" in this context.

On this subject, it always cracks me up that the same people that bitch and moan about the 'burden' that Indigenous people are on white society and who use the tropes that 'we send them so much money, why can't they get on their own two feet like everyone else' will then turn around and complain about the establishment of Indigenous Economic Zones (Urban Reserves).

I mean, pick a lane, buddy.

n/m

[wardlow]

Cue up the theme song from The Benny Hill Show...

The Kapyong Barracks years-long legal saga could again be back in the courts, with the Manitoba Métis Federation asking a federal judge to quash Ottawa's deal this summer to transfer land to First Nations.

"The Métis were just completely ignored," MMF President David Chartrand told the Free Press on Thursday.

"If the Métis are not being treated well, I’m going to react."

The group filed a request in Federal Court a month ago, arguing "all related ancillary decisions and agreements should be quashed or set aside," on the basis that Ottawa ignored Métis rights and the MMF's November 2015 request for consultation.

Last week, the MMF and Ottawa asked the court to put the legal action on hold for six months so the two can instead hold talks.

...

Source

Such a joke.

[esquire]

^ I dunno, the longer it gets delayed the more faith I have that the land will be sufficiently valuable to warrant a good development. As I've said before, if the site had been redeveloped in the 90s it would have just been a bunch of big boxes along the lines of St. James Street.

[WildCake]

Originally Posted by esquire

^ I dunno, the longer it gets delayed the more faith I have that the land will be sufficiently valuable to warrant a good development. As I've said before, if the site had been redeveloped in the 90s it would have just been a bunch of big boxes along the lines of St. James Street.

Fair point. At the same time, this has stretched out long enough that we are at a point in this city where land values would justify a more solid development. This is frustrating because MMF had 15 years to throw their hat in the ring with the court proceedings and the moment the land was awarded they cry 'not fair we want some too'. Child's play.

[Gm0ney]

Originally Posted by armorand93

If its like the service roads off Grant, that would definitely be a bonus. Granted it would impact pedestrian culture and the urban feel, but traffic would be alot less of a nightmare with a service road on the side.

Who is responsible for that service road in front of Grant Park? The City? It's gotta be a Top 5 Worst Road in town - and that's saying something! It's been in terrible shape since the 90s and they just keep intermittently patching.

[DancingDuck]

From the Free Press today:

"Former Kapyong Barracks plan to be unveiled

The preferred concept plan for the former site of Kapyong Barracks is set to be unveiled on Thursday.

Whelan Sutherland, CEO of the Treaty One Development Corp., said in a statement the plan is expected to create a development that balances economic opportunities for Treaty One First Nations but also blends in with existing area neighborhoods.

The plan for a First Nation urban economic zone was created from feedback during a public engagement process following the release of three concept plans last summer."

[Wpg_Guy]

Kapyong concept plan revealed
Planners hope for innovative, pedestrian-friendly project
By: Dylan Robertson Posted: 10/22/2020

OTTAWA — First Nations developers have taken local feedback into a new concept plan for the former Kapyong barracks lands, adding green space, lowering residential density and expanding Indigenous cultural spaces, the Free Press has learned.

Treaty One Development Corp. will unveil the new design this morning, which reveals where it expects to put schools, condos, and stores in the open space between Winnipeg’s Tuxedo and River Heights neighbourhoods.

"This is about creating an environment that blends well with existing neighbourhoods, while balancing sustainable economic opportunities for Treaty 1 First Nations," the group’s chief executive officer, Whelan Sutherland, wrote in a statement.

Treaty One is working with Canada Lands Co. (a federal Crown corporation) to develop the vacant, 160-acre site in south Winnipeg, which has sat unused since 2004, when the Canadian Forces shuttered the base.

Two-thirds of the site will be an urban reserve, or what the First Nations group calls an "urban economic-development zone."

Treaty One prepared an initial plan in late 2018, which it refined this spring into three concepts, mapping out components such as commercial and natural space, as well as the shape of streets.

Planners surveyed 1,000 locals, and also took feedback in a June video conference 800 people attended.

Using that advice, they had consultants at Scatliff Miller Murray architects update the design, which will now be used to seek formal approvals.

The concept plan shows slightly curvy streets with retail along most of Kenaston Boulevard, low-density housing (such as detached homes) bordering Tuxedo, and mid-density condos in between, with stores on the ground floor.

While developers will have to go through the City of Winnipeg’s usual zoning process, Treaty One has plotted out where it imagines some elements sitting.

North of Grant Avenue, a stormwater pool shaped like a yin-yang would anchor a circular park, surrounded by housing.

A supermarket is envisioned southwest of Taylor Avenue and Kenaston Boulevard. On the northeast corner would sit a cultural campus, which will likely include a war museum that commemorates Indigenous and non-Indigenous soldiers.

A gas bar would likely go along Taylor, just west of Centennial Street. A sports centre could be placed in the southeast corner of the former Kapyong lands, alongside the CN Rail line.

While urban reserves are common in other provinces, only small parcels in Winnipeg are identified as reserve land.

Treaty One hopes to use local First Nations names, and architecture that includes cultural concepts, while also building a client base for Indigenous businesses. The group has previously discussed a college, daycare, hotel and hospice on the sprawling site.

Planners hope for an innovative, pedestrian-friendly project that will connect to the city’s active transportation network.

This spring, one planner said at the town hall that parking would be designed "looking long into the future, about alternatives to cars." However, Treaty One said it has crafted a traffic-management plan, after neighbours said they’re worried about more cars.

Canada Lands said the feedback from Winnipeggers is among the most it’s ever received, and 75 per cent of respondents felt the project is headed in the right direction.

The Department of National Defence plans to finish demolishing military buildings on the site by October 2021. The Kapyong lands were part of a decade-long court battle before Ottawa handed the site over to First Nations in August 2019.

The bands hope to negotiate fees for policing and water with the city, instead of paying the full property tax rate.

One of the most common questions is whether Kenaston Boulevard will be widened; the developer said that decision rests with the city.

dylan.robertson@freepress.mb.ca

https://www.winnipegfreepress.com/lo...572825212.html

[esquire]

Looks pretty well like what I'd expect to see at that site. That is a lot of commercial and mixed use space, though... I wonder how that will work out given the rather large amount of commercial space built in recent years farther down Kenaston? Will there be enough demand to justify construction anytime soon?

[scoots82]

a ying and yang pond space? really?

[WildCake]

Originally Posted by esquire

Looks pretty well like what I'd expect to see at that site. That is a lot of commercial and mixed use space, though... I wonder how that will work out given the rather large amount of commercial space built in recent years farther down Kenaston? Will there be enough demand to justify construction anytime soon?

My thoughts exactly. Good plan except it seems like 1/3 of the space is commercial. For an area sandwiched by seasons of tuxedo/kenaston and polo park in an age of reduce brick and mortar retail, it seems a bit heavy.

I guess zoning could always be modified as demand presents itself.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by WildCake

My thoughts exactly. Good plan except it seems like 1/3 of the space is commercial. For an area sandwiched by seasons of tuxedo/kenaston and polo park in an age of reduce brick and mortar retail, it seems a bit heavy.

I guess zoning could always be modified as demand presents itself.

I think that 5-10 years ago this would have been built out pretty fast, but with the way things are now (massive sudden decline in bricks and mortar retail, slower population growth, economic recession) this thing is going to be built out very slowly... I could easily see it taking 20-25 years to fully build.

The approach to design is a big meh but I wasn't expecting much. It'll do.

[EspionNoir]

Originally Posted by scoots82

a ying and yang pond space? really?

I just noticed that in the plan and I like it’s. Pretty harmonious blend between Chinese culture and indigenous culture.

It’s nice to se indigenous persons starting to do business that will transform the community. I stayed at a hotel with a casino in Calgary last year for my Banff trip. If I remember correctly it was indigenous-owned. Should be a fairly profitable one.