Quote:
Originally Posted by jollyburger
Yeah, this is the fantasy thread which is why we're talking about a Burrard Skytrain. If it's going to cost a few billion they're probably better off making light transit across the North Shore and then dealing with bridge traffic through future mobility pricing.
|
And then some populist politician desperate for votes comes in and screws it up.
It makes no sense for tolls to be on the 2nd Narrows and not the Port Mann and Golden Ears.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tvisforme
You misunderstood my suggestion, it was not a "3-pronged line". It was:
Phase 1: Build a Hastings Line from downtown Vancouver to near the Ironworkers Memorial Crossing, then cross over to Phibbs Exchange (or a similar bus/SkyTrain hub in that area). That gets rapid transit along Hastings and gives another connection from the North Shore, drawing on the population in the Seymour area, the rapidly developing Lynnmour area and the proposed Maplewood developments in addition to existing transit routes that feed into Phibbs.
Phase 2: Extend the Hastings Line further east to cover northern Burnaby, alternating trains between the North Shore and Burnaby as with the Richmond/Airport service.
Phase 3: Separate the North Shore spur from the Hastings Line and extend it to create a new line running north-south to connect with all three east-west lines (Hastings, Millenium and Expo).
That's only one small part of what I said. Burnaby, however, is far easier to build in and is a much more compact municipality. Even with the estimates you've made about the North Shore, it still stretches all the way from Horseshoe Bay to Deep Cove - with lots of hard-to-build bits. Obviously the targets would increase, but you're not likely to ever see the same sort of density as with other municipalities. I'm not saying SkyTrain will never be needed, but when you look at projections in that RGS that have 2021 Burnaby, Tri-Cities, and Delta/Richmond/Tsawwassen all having larger populations than the entire North Shore two decades from now, one has to question what the most effective use of limited transit dollars might be. Again, I'm not saying "no" to higher-capacity transit, just arguing that there are more viable interim measures before a SkyTrain-level service is built.
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheTerminalCity
One of the North Shore's challenges is the topography places limits not just on readily-developable area but also on movement. The opportunity for a line over the Second Narrows to Phibbs, like you mention, would provide the substantive alternative option to driving. All the more so if a Skytrain at Phibbs extending westward roughly parallel to Marine all the way to Park Royal.
This also supports the development happening on the North Shore (Phibbs/Seylynn, Lower Lonsdale, Cap Mall, Capilano Hwy, Park Royal), which can further reinforce that main east-west corridor. Would also support the Lonsdale Quay as a hub, with Seabus and bus connections existing already and growth of population and destinations would occur around a high-capacity transit line with good access to both downtown Vancouver but the balance of the Lower Mainland through Second Narrows.
Whether that is worth the cost of extending a Skytrain across the inlet is another question, especially when the bulk of population growth is happening elsewhere in the region and the availability of funding for the various competing transit priorities.
|
In 1986? Also, Western West Van is basically completely irrelevant to possible transit service (they don't want it anyways) and the NS has much more developable greenfield than Burnaby. Not to mention anything going in that direction is likely to terminate in Ambleside (if it even goes beyond Park Royal) on one side and Phibbs on another. Removing the irrelevant lands actually makes it a better deal in terms than Burnaby, other than the inlet separating everything.
It's also important to point out that Richmond also went from 'discouraged under RGS' to 'encouraged under RGS'.
I'd like to also point out you're also only focusing on a small part of what I said. Comparing municipalities that are artificially kept small to those without those limitations is ridiculous. A mid-Harbour crossing would work for Suburban-Suburban transfers as well as DT transfers, 2nd Narrows only works for the former. Which, as Migrant Coconut said, makes it very niche.
Also, the area around Marine Dr. up to Ambleside and Pibbs is more or less a perfect grid. The area was developed long before everything else in the valley. Same thing with Upper Lonsdale.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut
Maybe? Local stations like are fine; it's the downtown and hub stations that're getting East Coast foot traffic.
Crystal Mall's not necessarily a problem - detour to McKay, then Imperial, then Boundary gets you to the River District (admittedly, it'll be a sharp turn off Willingdon unless it can go under/through the SFHs).
Having a real hard time finding a source for that one. Far as I know, that section of Waterfront was just part of the wall.
Again, stations elsewhere in downtown means that passengers leaving/heading there are on the train, not adding to the CBD loop's entrances.
On another note, a relief line from Roundhouse to Stadium could also reroute Canada/Expo transfers without funneling them through the loop.
Assuming a start at Metrotown, Renfrew's easier to access from the M-Line at Commercial, and Sunrise/PNE from a bus at 29th or Joyce-Collingwood. A Hastings-Willingdon Line could change that more significantly than B-Lines/RapidBuses.
I'm suggesting that we take the existing docks and make them SeaBus-sized. They only need to be larger, not deeper or calmer.
|
Yes, Skytrain is. It was
originallydesigned for 16,000pphpd (as Zwei will constantly remind you), and if we haven't reached it by now, we will soon. We're upgrading the system to go beyond that because the system as a whole wasn't designed for the foot traffic it's getting.
So what you're saying if we should build a West End subway?
And a relief line between Stadium and Yaletown... doesn't
sound worth it. People going to Richmond from the East are going to be using the Broadway.
Yeah, I don't know either. Either way, Translink does not make that much money off its RE. It could- and should on its DT Stations (esp. Waterfront), but losing their money isn't that big a deal. An MTR Mall, the Waterfront shops are not. On the grand scheme of things, the amount of money TransLink makes off retail is negligible (0.5M is nothing when the Translink budget is in the Billions- it's literally couch pennies)
https://dailyhive.com/vancouver/tran...n-retail-space
https://www.mtr.com.hk/en/corporate/...g_centres.html
I'm not too concerned about the River District (it's not worth building a Skytrain line down there just for 1 megadevelopment), but I am about getting there from the north (BCIT). To get to Metrotown Station requires a connection 1 block east. Either you demo Crystal Mall, the Burnaby Public Library, or go under the SFH and medium-density zoned properties to the north. Though, I THINK the BC government owns the land underground unless stated otherwise, but mineral rights =/= subsurface rights(
https://www2.gov.bc.ca/assets/gov/fa...nfoupdate7.pdf).
Care to help?
Yeah, maybe. But if a line connecting to the Millennium only gets you limited relief, than extending it to the Expo won't either if it's only the in-between stops that benefit. The line is necessary for other reasons, but not for relief. You'd be better spending money on commuter rail if that was your goal.
Sir, the SeaBus terminus on Waterfront is 72m wide x 83m long. Unless you can operate it off 1 berth, it's pretty wide. The existing Kits and Ambleside docks are not good for such a service. The latter one is not designed for boat docking at all, and the former is 15min away from an LRT Station on Pennyfarthing.
Prev
Literally the entire Marine Drive Corridor from Ambleside to Phibbs is lined with FTDA land. 
Linear Mode
